arXiv — Machine Learning · · 3 min read

Muon Is Theoretically Wrong For Convolutions, But Empirically Effective

Mirrored from arXiv — Machine Learning for archival readability. Support the source by reading on the original site.

Computer Science > Machine Learning

arXiv:2610.07103 (cs)
[Submitted on 5 Oct 2026]

Title:Muon Is Theoretically Wrong For Convolutions, But Empirically Effective

Authors:Thibaut Boissin (IRIT), Thomas Massena (IRIT, DTIPG - SNCF, UT3), Mathieu Serrurier (IRIT), Franck Mamalet
View a PDF of the paper titled Muon Is Theoretically Wrong For Convolutions, But Empirically Effective, by Thibaut Boissin (IRIT) and 5 other authors
View PDF
Abstract:Muon, an optimizer known for its efficiency, has a clear interpretation for matrix-valued updates, but convolutional kernels are stored as four-dimensional tensors. Standard implementations reshape these tensors into matrices, a shortcut which breaks the theoretical understanding behind Muon. To investigate this, we formalize the corresponding optimization objective directly in convolutional operator geometry and introduce Convolutional Newton-Schulz (Conv-NS), which approximates the polar factor in this geometry while preserving kernel support. When applied in fast training experiments, Conv-NS and reshape-based Muon are both computationally efficient and achieve comparable accuracy on CIFAR-10 and ImageNet classification tasks. However, as one could expect a theoretically aligned Conv-NS to outperform reshape-based Muon, we investigate this mismatch between practice and theoretical understanding, with the hypothesis that exact convolutional orthogonalization may overconstrain updates. These findings highlight Muon's strong practical performance while opening directions for its further development on convolutions. Our code is publicly available at \href{this https URL}{github conv-muon}.
Subjects: Machine Learning (cs.LG); Artificial Intelligence (cs.AI)
Cite as: arXiv:2610.07103 [cs.LG]
  (or arXiv:2610.07103v1 [cs.LG] for this version)
  https://doi.org/10.48550/arXiv.2610.07103
arXiv-issued DOI via DataCite (pending registration)

Submission history

From: Franck MAMALET [view email] [via CCSD proxy]
[v1] Mon, 5 Oct 2026 14:57:01 UTC (877 KB)
Full-text links:

Access Paper:

    View a PDF of the paper titled Muon Is Theoretically Wrong For Convolutions, But Empirically Effective, by Thibaut Boissin (IRIT) and 5 other authors
  • View PDF
  • TeX Source

Additional Features

Current browse context:

cs.LG
< prev   |   next >
Change to browse by:

References & Citations

Loading...

BibTeX formatted citation

loading...
Data provided by:

Bookmark

BibSonomy Reddit
Bibliographic Tools

Bibliographic and Citation Tools

Bibliographic Explorer Toggle
Bibliographic Explorer (What is the Explorer?)
Connected Papers Toggle
Connected Papers (What is Connected Papers?)
Litmaps Toggle
Litmaps (What is Litmaps?)
scite.ai Toggle
scite Smart Citations (What are Smart Citations?)
Code, Data, Media

Code, Data and Media Associated with this Article

alphaXiv Toggle
alphaXiv (What is alphaXiv?)
Links to Code Toggle
CatalyzeX Code Finder for Papers (What is CatalyzeX?)
DagsHub Toggle
DagsHub (What is DagsHub?)
GotitPub Toggle
Gotit.pub (What is GotitPub?)
Huggingface Toggle
Hugging Face (What is Huggingface?)
ScienceCast Toggle
ScienceCast (What is ScienceCast?)
Demos

Demos

Replicate Toggle
Replicate (What is Replicate?)
Spaces Toggle
Hugging Face Spaces (What is Spaces?)
Spaces Toggle
TXYZ.AI (What is TXYZ.AI?)
Related Papers

Recommenders and Search Tools

Link to Influence Flower
Influence Flower (What are Influence Flowers?)
Core recommender toggle
CORE Recommender (What is CORE?)
IArxiv recommender toggle
IArxiv Recommender (What is IArxiv?)
About arXivLabs

arXivLabs: experimental projects with community collaborators

arXivLabs is a framework that allows collaborators to develop and share new arXiv features directly on our website.

Both individuals and organizations that work with arXivLabs have embraced and accepted our values of openness, community, excellence, and user data privacy. arXiv is committed to these values and only works with partners that adhere to them.

Have an idea for a project that will add value for arXiv's community? Learn more about arXivLabs.

Discussion (0)

Sign in to join the discussion. Free account, 30 seconds — email code or GitHub.

Sign in →

No comments yet. Sign in and be the first to say something.

More from arXiv — Machine Learning